Forum | phishing and physics....

My understanding of the recoil rig is that the spectastic is between the weight and the main line. I've seen the video of the recoil rig in action on SW's web site and what I saw was the bait perpendicular to the main line. Aso, because the hook/bait is tied to the main line and the goal is to achieve life like animation smaller diameter line is probably a safe bet. And with lighter line I would downsize in rod as well fairly powerful yet perhaps a moderate action. And it is because of my concept of what rod that would work best – I suggested a limited amount of weight. Response time using a heavier weight on a moderate rod could affect success/failure in hook setting situations. Again…. just all my opinion as I've nev'a drop-shotted much less recoiled! Well ok I've recoiled but not in a fishing situation!

While we're on the subject of weights… when you go to a heavier c'rig weight… don't forget to crank down on the drag. Gar'on'tee the first time you set a hook you will feel the drag slip. Mine is virtually locked down and was the cause for lost fish and bent hooks on lighter wire 3/0 Gammies. Since I've gone back to the heavier 3/0 Owners it's a thing of the past. My bite/cast ratio probably didn't go up using the heavier hook but by the same token I don't feel it went down either! If your not using minimum 17# test leader, preferably 20#… 'least have some on the boat with you so you can go to it when the flippin' stick starts snapping leaders like spider webs.

lilmule said:

Light weights,crig

Dont know what weight would be good for a recoil as never used one as yet but would tend to think it would be lighter than say a crig.

Using the recoil method, which is an altered form of drop shotting, I'd suspect nothing over 1/2oz would or could be utilized. The lighter line requirment for effective bait presentation is for sure a limiting factor. While I'm not a fan of flurocarbon line I will probably use it for this application instead of braid for two reasons. One is the stiffer flurocarbon or fluroclear from P-Line will cause the bait to stand off from the main line better and I am trying to provide a very life like imitatiion of a bait – usually in very clear water. Being used, except when executing the recoil, on a semi-slack line actually feeling the bite is probably the exception rather than the rule so line tension for bite detection is pretty much a moot point.

Steve, when you do be sure to slide on a 1oz. sinker. If you've been using ligher than that you may be surprised at what you can feel now vs what you could feel before.

As for using shorter rods… You may well catch fish with it but you simply are not experiencing all the advantages c'rigging brings to the plate with a shorter rod. With a 7'6-8' rod the distance on cast can not be compared to the shorter rod. The c'rig is an excellent search bait it tells you two things: what the bottom compostion is and if there are fish there. The further you can cast – the more searching you can do. I have no problems with bass up to 8#'s with my current rig and I'm sure double digit would pose no problems either – should I ever hook one!

I understand we all have our likes, dislikes and preferences but I encourage to at least give it a try and see what you've been missin'!

The Shimano Convergence MH, 7.0 is also another fairly cheap rod that works on criging,both it and the lightning are about 40 bucks at wally world,possibly again shorter than what you like.

I own both of them,and both work fairly well at least for me.

So understand why you wish to build your own as you will end up with what you like in a rod.

LM…. I'm probably not a c'rig expert – but I have been doin' it a looooong time. If you're not using a least a 7'6″ c'rig stick – you're stuggling with the method. My current c'rig is a shimano Chronarch 7.0 and a 7'6″ CastAway flipping stick. My next one may well still be with the Chronarch but will be an 8' rod. Angler height plays no roll as a disadvantage when c'riggin' relative to casting and is probably actually an advantage as it keeps the rig from hitting the water on the back swing.

From the specs. I've read on the frog rod it would be a good candidate for a c'rig though at 7'3″ still too short. But that action – soft tip n' lots of back bone is what I look for in a c'rig. The soft tip helps in detecting the bite before the bite'er(fish) detects you. The length is required for two reasons…. Casting. I can't even begin to imagine casting a 3/4oz, much less 1oz., c'rig with a 30″ leader on a 6'6″ stick – you are to be commended on your casting skills!

The other reason is the hook set. If that fish you just detected is swimming towards you. Deduct 30″ from the effective lenght of your 6'6″ rod. You are now trying the set the hook with basically a 4' rod. Might prove pretty difficult. Due to tip arch and pivot point(reel seat) when you set the hook the actual effective rod length may not really be 4' but you get the idea. On a 8' rod the distance the tip travles through an arch  is far greater thus moving more line and your chances of setting the hook in the "power" portion of the hook set are greater by factors of 10. On the 6'6″ rod you would be close to the top of the arc, max hook set, just about the time you encounter the fish. And it's at that point that actual hook setting power it at it's least.

Some folks pivot with the rod horozontial to achieve more line movement but an arch is an arch and at the end of the hook set, regardless of the method, actual hook setting power is just about nil.

Being as my current c'rig rod is a 7'6″ flipping stick – going lighter leaves a bit of room to manuver and still have fish handling capabilities. That said – even with a lighter rod – it will still be 7'6″ to 8' in length. The only exception to that will be if I build a c'rig for fishing tight to docks. At that time I'd probably drop the length to 7' but…. I'd probably only use a 12-18″ leader.

Steve, I was talking about both light line and light weights. As you know the weight of the line tends to pendulum the bait on the drop…. well it also has an influence when you're tying to pull on  the line to feel the bite without moving the weight/bait. With lighter line you should be able to apply more relative tension without moving the lighter weight. Additionally you'd be able to use a lighter rod which transmits the bite better than a heavier rod.

The problem with fishing lighter weights with a c'rig, especially in current, is the in ability to control them. They won't hold when the line get's a current induced bow in them making it very difficult to feel a bite. If, by use of a heavier weight, you can eliminate the weight moving, unless you want it to – you'll feel more bites than you are now. When you try to put a little tension on the line with a lighter weight – it moves. That's not what you want when c'riggin'

If I was fishing heavy current with a c'rig I'd use the lightest line braid I could sling – probably 20# and the heaviest weight I could reasonably use. Light line reduces current induced bow in the line. Heavier weight keeps it put unless I want to move it. For me… the only limitation on the amount of weight would be the ability to execute an effective hook set.

I'm not sure how y'all are setting up your c'rigs. But done in the classic manner the fish will never feel the weight, be it 1/32oz or a 25# anchor…. unless the line wraps around it on the cast. At which time you're now fishing with a 25# split-shot rig! LOL….